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alcibiades i-第12章

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considered; but now; instead of absolute existence; we have been

considering the nature of individual existence; and this may; perhaps; be

sufficient; for surely there is nothing which may be called more properly

ourselves than the soul?



ALCIBIADES:  There is nothing。



SOCRATES:  Then we may truly conceive that you and I are conversing with

one another; soul to soul?



ALCIBIADES:  Very true。



SOCRATES:  And that is just what I was saying beforethat I; Socrates; am

not arguing or talking with the face of Alcibiades; but with the real

Alcibiades; or in other words; with his soul。



ALCIBIADES:  True。



SOCRATES:  Then he who bids a man know himself; would have him know his

soul?



ALCIBIADES:  That appears to be true。



SOCRATES:  He whose knowledge only extends to the body; knows the things of

a man; and not the man himself?



ALCIBIADES:  That is true。



SOCRATES:  Then neither the physician regarded as a physician; nor the

trainer regarded as a trainer; knows himself?



ALCIBIADES:  He does not。



SOCRATES:  The husbandmen and the other craftsmen are very far from knowing

themselves; for they would seem not even to know their own belongings? 

When regarded in relation to the arts which they practise they are even

further removed from self…knowledge; for they only know the belongings of

the body; which minister to the body。



ALCIBIADES:  That is true。



SOCRATES:  Then if temperance is the knowledge of self; in respect of his

art none of them is temperate?



ALCIBIADES:  I agree。



SOCRATES:  And this is the reason why their arts are accounted vulgar; and

are not such as a good man would practise?



ALCIBIADES:  Quite true。



SOCRATES:  Again; he who cherishes his body cherishes not himself; but what

belongs to him?



ALCIBIADES:  That is true。



SOCRATES:  But he who cherishes his money; cherishes neither himself nor

his belongings; but is in a stage yet further removed from himself?



ALCIBIADES:  I agree。



SOCRATES:  Then the money…maker has really ceased to be occupied with his

own concerns?



ALCIBIADES:  True。



SOCRATES:  And if any one has fallen in love with the person of Alcibiades;

he loves not Alcibiades; but the belongings of Alcibiades?



ALCIBIADES:  True。



SOCRATES:  But he who loves your soul is the true lover?



ALCIBIADES:  That is the necessary inference。



SOCRATES:  The lover of the body goes away when the flower of youth fades?



ALCIBIADES:  True。



SOCRATES:  But he who loves the soul goes not away; as long as the soul

follows after virtue?



ALCIBIADES:  Yes。



SOCRATES:  And I am the lover who goes not away; but remains with you; when

you are no longer young and the rest are gone?



ALCIBIADES:  Yes; Socrates; and therein you do well; and I hope that you

will remain。



SOCRATES:  Then you must try to look your best。



ALCIBIADES:  I will。



SOCRATES:  The fact is; that there is only one lover of Alcibiades the son

of Cleinias; there neither is nor ever has been seemingly any other; and he

is his darling;Socrates; the son of Sophroniscus and Phaenarete。



ALCIBIADES:  True。



SOCRATES:  And did you not say; that if I had not spoken first; you were on

the point of coming to me; and enquiring why I only remained?



ALCIBIADES:  That is true。



SOCRATES:  The reason was that I loved you for your own sake; whereas other

men love what belongs to you; and your beauty; which is not you; is fading

away; just as your true self is beginning to bloom。  And I will never

desert you; if you are not spoiled and deformed by the Athenian people; for

the danger which I most fear is that you will become a lover of the people

and will be spoiled by them。  Many a noble Athenian has been ruined in this

way。  For the demus of the great…hearted Erechteus is of a fair

countenance; but you should see him naked; wherefore observe the caution

which I give you。



ALCIBIADES:  What caution?



SOCRATES:  Practise yourself; sweet friend; in learning what you ought to

know; before you enter on politics; and then you will have an antidote

which will keep you out of harm's way。



ALCIBIADES:  Good advice; Socrates; but I wish that you would explain to me

in what way I am to take care of myself。



SOCRATES:  Have we not made an advance? for we are at any rate tolerably

well agreed as to what we are; and there is no longer any danger; as we

once feared; that we might be taking care not of ourselves; but of

something which is not ourselves。



ALCIBIADES:  That is true。



SOCRATES:  And the next step will be to take care of the soul; and look to

that?



ALCIBIADES:  Certainly。



SOCRATES:  Leaving the care of our bodies and of our properties to others?



ALCIBIADES:  Very good。



SOCRATES:  But how can we have a perfect knowledge of the things of the

soul?For if we know them; then I suppose we shall know ourselves。  Can we

really be ignorant of the excellent meaning of the Delphian inscription; of

which we were just now speaking?



ALCIBIADES:  What have you in your thoughts; Socrates?



SOCRATES:  I will tell you what I suspect to be the meaning and lesson of

that inscription。  Let me take an illustration from sight; which I imagine

to be the only one suitable to my purpose。



ALCIBIADES:  What do you mean?



SOCRATES:  Consider; if some one were to say to the eye; 'See thyself;' as

you might say to a man; 'Know thyself;' what is the nature and meaning of

this precept?  Would not his meaning be:That the eye should look at that

in which it would see itself?



ALCIBIADES:  Clearly。



SOCRATES:  And what are the objects in looking at which we see ourselves?



ALCIBIADES:  Clearly; Socrates; in looking at mirrors and the like。



SOCRATES:  Very true; and is there not something of the nature of a mirror

in our own eyes?



ALCIBIADES:  Certainly。



SOCRATES:  Did you ever observe that the face of the person looking into

the eye of another is reflected as in a mirror; and in the visual organ

which is over against him; and which is called the pupil; there is a sort

of image of the person looking?



ALCIBIADES:  That is quite true。



SOCRATES:  Then the eye; looking at another eye; and at that in the eye

which is most perfect; and which is the instrument of vision; will there

see itself?



ALCIBIADES:  That is evident。



SOCRATES:  But looking at anything else either in man or in the world; and

not to what resembles this; it will not see itself?



ALCIBIADES:  Very true。



SOCRATES:  Then if the eye is to see itself; it must look at the eye; and

at that part of the eye where sight which is the virtue of the eye resides?



ALCIBIADES:  True。



SOCRATES:  And if the soul; my dear Alcibiades; is ever to know herself;

must she not look at the soul; and especially at that part of the soul in

which her virtue resides; and to any other which is like this?



ALCIBIADES:  I agree; Socrates。



SOCRATES:  And do we know of any part of our souls more divine than that

which has to do with wisdom and knowledge?



ALCIBIADES:  There is none。



SOCRATES:  Then this is that part of the soul which resembles the divine;

and he who looks at this and at the whole class of things divine; will be

most likely to know himself?



ALCIBIADES:  Clearly。



SOCRATES:  And self…knowledge we agree to be wisdom?



ALCIBIADES:  True。



SOCRATES:  But if we have no self…knowledge and no wisdom; can we ever know

our own good and evil?



ALCIBIADES:  How can we; Socrates?



SOCRATES:  You mean; that if you did not know Alcibiades; there would be no

possibility of your knowing that what belonged to Alcibiades was really

his?



ALCIBIADES:  It would be quite impossible。



SOCRATES:  Nor should we know that we were the persons to whom anything

belonged; if we did not know ourselves?



ALCIBIADES:  How could we?



SOCRATES:  And if we did not know our own belongings; neither should we

know the belongings of our belongings?



ALCIBIADES:  Clearly not。



SOCRATES:  Then we were not altogether right in acknowledging just now that

a man may know what belongs to him and yet not know himself; nay; rather he

cannot even know the belongings of his belongings; for the discernment of

the things of self; and of the things which belong to the things of self;

appear all to be the business of the same man; and of the same art。



ALCIBIADES:  So much may be supposed。



SOCRATES:  And he who knows not the things which belong to himself; will in

like manner be ignorant of the things which belong to others?



ALCIBIADES:  Very true。



SOCRATES:  And if he knows not the affairs of others; he will not know the

affairs of states?



ALCIBIADES:  Certainly not。



SOCRATES:  Then such a man can never be a statesman?



ALCIBIADES:  He cannot。



SOCRAT
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